Politics/Slapfights - Ancient history to modern day!

[Raga]

They'd held it since the late 18th century. More importantly the Ukrainians weren't strong enough to hold it and no one stronger cared to stop it from happening.

Maybe if they get a little scarier our "Allies" will finally start taking their responsibilities seriously.

By this measure, Trump should just bend over and take it up the ass from China because they are or will very shortly be stronger than us.

But that's also a pivot of justification, does Russia deserve it because they can take it even though it wasn't theirs, or is it intrinsically theirs and thus they deserve it whether they are strong enough to hold it or not?

The Soviets weren't strong enough to hold it and modern Russia isn't either. The most they can do is indirectly destabilize it.

[Mobius_118]

He already bends over and takes it up the ass.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

They'd held it since the late 18th century. More importantly the Ukrainians weren't strong enough to hold it and no one stronger cared to stop it from happening.

Maybe if they get a little scarier our "Allies" will finally start taking their responsibilities seriously.

By this measure, Trump should just bend over and take it up the ass from China because they are or will very shortly be stronger than us.

But that's also a pivot of justification, does Russia deserve it because they can take it even though it wasn't theirs, or is it intrinsically theirs and thus they deserve it whether they are strong enough to hold it or not?

The Soviets weren't strong enough to hold it and modern Russia isn't either. The most they can do is indirectly destabilize it.

And yet they've taken Crimea.

Claims and historical ties are important. But ultimately when it comes to nations strength matters.

The Chinese do not have staying power. They rely almost entirely on exporting and we're a bigger trade partner for them than they are for us. There's a reason we won that tariff war.

[Mobius_118]

They make almost everything we buy. They cut us off, we're going to be unable to recover fast enough to recreate the cheap goods. People will pay more for basic goods, and the poverty gap will increase.

Basic economics of supply and demand. We demand, they supply. They stop supplying, 98% of the nation suffers until we can supply ourselves. Fuck knows that won't happen.

Your interpretations of things is...poor. Seek mental help.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

I'll get right on that buddy. As soon as you avail yourself of some fine Venezuelan medical care.

[Mobius_118]

GodDAMN you're retarded.

Every other civilized Western Nation has socialized healthcare, and it works pretty fucking well.

Why you fight having your taxes do something other than fund the military is beyond stupid. Oh, right. You're a Libertarian. Taxation is theft and all that.

Enjoy not having any tax-funded amenity. No roads, no public power, no police, etc. No wonder Libertarianism is a failed idea.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Then you should have zero problem traveling to Venezuela to experience the glories of Socialism.

[Mobius_118]

Why go there when I can stay here and experience a budding dictatorship?

We already have a couple collaborators here who are just fine with child-focused concentration camps.

[Mazder]

Every other civilized Western Nation has socialized healthcare, and it works pretty fucking well.

While true the quality of that healthcare is not on the same level as the USA's equivalent, at least not across the board.
An ideal would be A mix of US and socialized system without big corporations able to simply buy out the medical field.

Social being the basic and private for specialized. You could also have private practices for those that can afford it, but then there would be just the same problem of only the rich getting good healthcare.

My personal ideal would be everyone able to access the best healthcare as standard with no need to pay through the nose for it. But it would never happen.
Healthcare, IMO is a human right, not a privilege.

[TTTX]

Why go there when I can stay here and experience a budding dictatorship?

We already have a couple collaborators here who are just fine with child-focused concentration camps.

Last I checked USA don't concentration camps, let alone child-focused ones.

[Mobius_118]

A quick search proves otherwise, we just prefer the term "internment camp."

We're separating families, and putting the kids in cages. That's inexcusable. Imprisoning people for seeking asylum, which is what the overwhelming majority of "illegals" are doing, is inexcusable.

Soon enough it'll be political opponents too.

[TheodoricFriede]

Do you just spend all day every day in the political thread being angry that people dont agree with you?

[Mobius_118]

No, just pointing out the insanity of the denial of reality by certain members of this group when it's right in front of them.

I have a good chuckle at Grand Admiral Cheesedicks attempts to justify supporting stupid bullshit. That's about it.

[TheodoricFriede]

Thats why you are here?

That is... so very sad.

[TTTX]

A quick search proves otherwise, we just prefer the term "internment camp."

We're separating families, and putting the kids in cages. That's inexcusable. Imprisoning people for seeking asylum, which is what the overwhelming majority of "illegals" are doing, is inexcusable.

Soon enough it'll be political opponents too.

last I checked those people didn't go through the proper channels, it the reason why they got locked up in the first place until they can be sent back to their families, which takes time.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

A quick search proves otherwise, we just prefer the term "internment camp."

We're separating families, and putting the kids in cages. That's inexcusable. Imprisoning people for seeking asylum, which is what the overwhelming majority of "illegals" are doing, is inexcusable.

Soon enough it'll be political opponents too.

last I checked those people didn't go through the proper channels, it the reason why they got locked up in the first place until they can be sent back to their families, which takes time.

It's also something that was done in the Bush and Obama administrations.

But Mobius doesn't care about that.

[Mobius_118]

Thats why you are here?

That is... so very sad.

What's sad is that despite everything, GAC still is an adamant maggot.

There's no cure for being a dickless weasel. He's the perfect example of that.

Now it's just watching him descend into madness as reality comes crashing down around him.

I'm not even going to rip on you for your shit. No point.

last I checked those people didn't go through the proper channels, it the reason why they got locked up in the first place until they can be sent back to their families, which takes time.

Even the ones that did go through the proper channels are being picked up. Hell, ICE is trying to pick up legal citizens for the crime of looking vaguely ethnic.

The amount of asylum seekers being detained vs genuine border crossers who had no intention of doing the legal thing is night and day. These people don't deserve to be thrown into cages regardless.

It's also something that was done in the Bush and Obama administrations.

But Mobius doesn't care about that.

I did. Still do.

However, even you, cheesedick, can't deny that President Obama and President Bush didn't separate families and put them into fucking cages.

[TheodoricFriede]

God you're just gross.

Its not even the un-nuanced political opinions or the endless ranting. You are just unpleasant. Everything you say sounds like its coming out of the mouth of a parody of angry midwest teenager. Not only do you insult people constantly, but you insult them with the most childish, vulgar, gross things you can think of.

For your sake I hope this is just how you talk on the internet. Because every single post you make that I decide to look at, or more frequently see in someone else's quoting, makes me feel like i'm looking at a bucket of maggots.

[Mobius_118]

Talking normally resulted in nothing, reflecting the attitude I normally see gets me called what GAC actually is.

And your own personal feelings towards me have nothing to do with your "bucket of maggots"? I highly doubt that.

[Mazder]

Talking normally resulted in nothing, reflecting the attitude I normally see gets me called what GAC actually is.

And your own personal feelings towards me have nothing to do with your "bucket of maggots"? I highly doubt that.

No, talking normally got you trolled, which you fed into, which meant escalation until now it's just you laying insults and rants at every tiny word that person says.
I bet if he agreed with you on something you'd think it a ploy (which it probably would be and we'd watch on in case it was) and would not trust it, despite being desperate to try and get that very thing from him.

Also I gotta agree with Theo here that while I don't expect GAC's posts to be the cleanliest of clean and wholesome, yours however have taken a real nosedive in their objective, or even just civil nature to those you disagree with.
It appears that everyone who isn't aligned with your comments and beliefs are at GAC level or worse, or ignored/dealt with briefly.

[Mobius_118]

Yeah it's not so pretty is it? Good thing everything said here means nothing to me, and is not a reflection of how I am day to day.

Psychology is a fun subject, and watching the more fervent of you people escalate is hilarious.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Thats why you are here?

That is... so very sad.

What's sad is that despite everything, GAC still is an adamant maggot.

There's no cure for being a dickless weasel. He's the perfect example of that.

Now it's just watching him descend into madness as reality comes crashing down around him.

I'm not even going to rip on you for your shit. No point.

last I checked those people didn't go through the proper channels, it the reason why they got locked up in the first place until they can be sent back to their families, which takes time.

Even the ones that did go through the proper channels are being picked up. Hell, ICE is trying to pick up legal citizens for the crime of looking vaguely ethnic.

The amount of asylum seekers being detained vs genuine border crossers who had no intention of doing the legal thing is night and day. These people don't deserve to be thrown into cages regardless.

It's also something that was done in the Bush and Obama administrations.

But Mobius doesn't care about that.

I did. Still do.

However, even you, cheesedick, can't deny that President Obama and President Bush didn't separate families and put them into fucking cages.

Those pictures Talcum X talked about were from the Obama Administration actually.

Nice try though.

[Mobius_118]

Link first, then talk.

Because in my search to verify what you just claimed, I've found those photos to be from the last few months. Not the Obama Administration.

Nice try, though.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Look up Shaun King's history.

You'll find exactly what I'm talking about.

[Mobius_118]

Yeah...funny thing about that.

President Obama did deport a large amount of illegal immigrants. What he didn't do was separate families and keep the kids in cages.

I have little issue with deportation itself. It's the practices being used by the current administration that violates human rights.

Something the Obama Administration didn't do was violate human rights.

Quit trying to justify the behavior of the trump "administration".

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Tbh I don't actually care about your feels.

Politics doesn't either.

[TheodoricFriede]

And your own personal feelings towards me have nothing to do with your "bucket of maggots"? I highly doubt that.

Mobius, if my closest friend spoke to people the way you did, I would compare their maggotry to yours.

Also they wouldn't be my closest friend for much longer.

[Mobius_118]

Says the follower of a failed ideology.

Also, this isn't about my feelings, it's about the violation of International Law from the UN that we are subject to uphold.

Specifically, the 1951 Refugee Convention, which applies to refugees and asylum seekers.

As long as we are a member, we are obligated to uphold the UN Doctrines. This is a major violation of those doctrines.

Mobius, if my closest friend spoke to people the way you did, I would compare their maggotry to yours.

Also they wouldn't be my closest friend for much longer.

That's fair. I've dropped a lot of Conservative friends for acting as such.

What I've been doing is a dark reflection of what I experience every day when I encounter a trump supporter. It's annoying, isn't it?

[TheodoricFriede]

Except you have always been like this.

I'm just the only one that remembers, because I'm the one that called you out on your bullshit first.

Don't blame it on Trump Supporters. That reflection you are seeing is your own.

[Mobius_118]

Incorrect, but nice try.

[TheodoricFriede]

Welp.

At least other people see it now.

[Mobius_118]

Right...believe what you want.

[Mazder]

Right...believe what you want.

I see it.
Or at least the facade of what you want us to see has dropped.

You claim to have no connection, or find things "fun" (while being a total chore/bore) yet you still return, even if to "insult" GAC (BTW none of your insults have landed yet, that much is obvious). That doesn't sound like someone who is just "in it for the entertainment/lulz". It sounds like someone who is pretending to know/think they're in it for that, the same way an elderly relative might refer to a Nintendo Switch as a "gameboys".

I mean, honestly, the ones who are more active either disagree or are ambivalent feelings/ideas about you, so who do you think you're even connecting with during these talks in here, even during the insult slinging it all usually comes down to everyone against you. Surely anyone with an iota of common sense would see the writing on the wall that they're doing something to turn people away and make more enemies needlessly.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

I like how economic migrants count as asylum seekers.

Reeeeeally creative labeling.

[Mobius_118]

I like how all of you assumed something was off when I was just gauging opinions and seeing just how far-gone the rest of you actually are.

I like how economic migrants count as asylum seekers.

Reeeeeally creative labeling.

Oh, perfect example. Either he'll answer truthfully or evade.

Hey man, you support separating families and putting kids in cages. You hardly get to say anything now.

Go on, justify the behavior that violates international law and human rights.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

You're talking about your feelings again.

They're not asylum seekers. They're economic migrants.

[Mobius_118]

Ah, evasion.

Don't pretend your family didn't migrate here for economic reasons.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Yep. But they did it legally. It's why they weren't deported.

[Mobius_118]

Also, I mention human rights and international law violation because this isn't about my feelings. This is about the law. You know what laws are, don't you?

A set of rules used to create predictable human behavior? Also to ensure reasonable human interactions? Deviants are punished by the law?

Surely even you can understand that.

Yep. But they did it legally. It's why they weren't deported.

Yeah that doesn't satisfy anything. They were white. We have your fellow conservatives trying to get native born people of color reported to ICE.

President Obama was able to deport people without breaking up families. Justify the change to separating families. Go on.

Not once did I say deportations weren't necessary. I do say that this nation was built by immigrants, as does every historian I talk to.

But go ahead, justify the change from deporting the whole family unless the children are covered under DACA, to separating the children into camps without their parents.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Yes Mobius yes! Get MORE obstinate! Cling closer to your ideology!

DACA should be removed entirely and every single one of these illegals should be deported to the shit holes they came from.

They aren't asylum seekers. They entered this country illegally and they will suffer for it as they should.

[Mobius_118]

By the way, illegal entry into the US is a misdemeanor. Separating children from their parents, which violates the UN Human Rights laws.

So, next time you get a misdemeanor, be sure to drop your kids off at the nearest detention center. The law applies to you, if you're going to attempt to use Sessions logic.

Yes Mobius yes! Get MORE obstinate! Cling closer to your ideology!

DACA should be removed entirely and every single one of these illegals should be deported to the shit holes they came from.

They aren't asylum seekers. They entered this country illegally and they will suffer for it as they should.

Yeah I'm not being obstinate if I use law to show everyone what kind of person you are.

[Mobius_118]

Funny. Laws are an ideology now.

Answer the question: Do you support separating children from their parents for a misdemeanor, an action which violates human rights laws, as well as the Constitution?

I'll repeat what I said before: I have little issue with deporting illegal immigrants. I do have a problem with violating their basic human rights that are guaranteed under the 4th, 5th, and 14th Amendments of the US Constitution.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Funny. Laws are an ideology now.

Answer the question: Do you support separating children from their parents for a misdemeanor, an action which violates human rights laws, as well as the Constitution?

I'll repeat what I said before: I have little issue with deporting illegal immigrants. I do have a problem with violating their basic human rights that are guaranteed under the 4th, 5th, and 14th Amendments of the US Constitution.

Nobody outside of your echo chamber cares about this. At all.

Criminals are being punished and people like you are furious. I'm happy.

You already have hacks like Maher praying for economic collapse entirely because it would make the president look bad.

[Mobius_118]

Answer the question, you coward.

[Mobius_118]

Be intellectually honest for once.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

I don't care about your moral grandstanding. You're not going to use "Think of the Chilluns" to sway anyone because the Far Left has lost all their moral capital.

You're bankrupt. It's why the Democrats got skullfucked in 2016.

[Mobius_118]

It's not morality-based, it's law violation.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

"Think of the CHILDREN!!!!"

They're not asylum seekers. They are economic migrants who entered the country illegally and were caught. We have every right to secure our own borders. Ask the Canadians or Mexicans how they handle illegal "Guests".

[Augustei]

Link first, then talk.

Because in my search to verify what you just claimed, I've found those photos to be from the last few months. Not the Obama Administration.

Nice try, though.

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2014/ ... yifGqczaUk

Jun 22 2014
Obama Administration

Those kids were unaccompanied.

As to breaking up families, he only had the nerve to do it when the mothers weren't there as far as I can tell, or when they were lone individuals he'd ship them to the other side of mexico. The man had a huge fucking ego after all, understandable to attain when you have the MSM licking your ball sweat every day, crying mothers don't look good in the press, so just separate the fathers from their children.
https://lawandcrime.com/immigration/oba ... ies-too-2/

[Mazder]

Yeah that doesn't satisfy anything. They were white. We have your fellow conservatives trying to get native born people of color reported to ICE.

President Obama was able to deport people without breaking up families. Justify the change to separating families. Go on.

Not once did I say deportations weren't necessary. I do say that this nation was built by immigrants, as does every historian I talk to.

But go ahead, justify the change from deporting the whole family unless the children are covered under DACA, to separating the children into camps without their parents.

Well if by your own judgement we have to follow the law then we Have to split up the families.
The kids got in through the birthing loophole but the parents, who got in illegally, didn't. So to send the illegals out you have to separate the kids, who are legal citizens, from the illegal citizens.
This would be a time when your country's laws clash with what you deem to be "okay" and "lawful" by human rights standards.
Pick one, international law, or your own law.

I'll repeat what I said before: I have little issue with deporting illegal immigrants. I do have a problem with violating their basic human rights that are guaranteed under the 4th, 5th, and 14th Amendments of the US Constitution.

Which would only apply to the kids as they're the only ones who are legal citizens under that constitution. The parents aren't however. So they don't actually have those rights. Once they become legal citizens they will.

And TBH the whole "people who are born here" rule needs an additional bit put in where it's "those born here to legal citizens should be allowed to stay" or you get the exact problem of illegal immigrants coming over, breeding a bunch and getting their family in scot free.