Bioware General (Mass Effect/Dragon Age/Other)

[Raga]

And if it was just a matter of Shepard's memories and perspective being added to the Reapers and Catalyst's collective, it's extremely unlikely a single mind would have influenced it in a meaningful way.

The thing is we *know* it was influenced in some meaningful way. We just don't know precisely how that way was. The very fact that the Catalyst allows this option at all and that Shep AI doesn't immediately start reaping again means that something did in fact change.

[Alienmorph]

Exactly. So that means that to a certain degree you have one single mortal mind, or a faithful copy of it, being put in charge of policing an whole galaxy for potentially millions or even billions of years. Not so sure it's such a great idea.

[Raga]

Exactly. So that means that to a certain degree you have one single mortal mind, or a faithful copy of it, being put in charge of policing an whole galaxy for potentially millions or even billions of years. Not so sure it's such a great idea.

That's an enormous extrapolation. "It was influenced in some meaningful way" in no way automatically means that organic Shepard is the one in charge forever. We don't actually know what happens. As I've said, I think the magic is in the combination of Shep thought processes + Reaper data and thought processes and perspective because that is in line with a recurring them in the series. But we have no way of knowing either of these scenarios is the case.

[Vol]

RE: Jardaan - I was always under the impression they were supposed to answer the question of "Why aren't the Andromeda species super advanced compared to us?", as they are the absentee gods (hyper-advanced civilization) of their galaxy, and we're fumbling around with their abandoned children (Angara, Remnants) against the abandoned children (Kett) of whoever was fighting the Jardaan and created the Scourge.

See, it's actually a decent way of explaining why Andromeda isn't some impossibly advanced galaxy due to lack of reaping. The Jardaan made it to threshold well beyond anything we know...and so did their enemy, who then fought it out, and fled, and so we arrive to find the scraps, which are relatively similar to what we know.

[Someone With Mass]

It's sad when I care more about the history of the Remnant, the guard bots, than the kett, the main bad guys and a general snore in the game.

I'll admit that I was a bit fascinated by the fact that the Jardaan rose to power, built the Remnant and spread all their technology throughout the Heleus cluster and then just disappeared after creating the Scourge. The rise and fall of a very influential and technologically advanced society happened while the Initiative was in dark space between the two galaxies.

[magnuskn]

Exactly. So that means that to a certain degree you have one single mortal mind, or a faithful copy of it, being put in charge of policing an whole galaxy for potentially millions or even billions of years. Not so sure it's such a great idea.

That's an enormous extrapolation. "It was influenced in some meaningful way" in no way automatically means that organic Shepard is the one in charge forever. We don't actually know what happens. As I've said, I think the magic is in the combination of Shep thought processes + Reaper data and thought processes and perspective because that is in line with a recurring them in the series. But we have no way of knowing either of these scenarios is the case.

So, um, yeah. Basically even with your interpretation, the galaxy eventually gets fisted by Reapers all over again. So, first slavery for a few millenia, followed by endless galaxycide once again. Great ending, BW. ^^

[Raga]

Um, how does my ending mean that? I *don't* think AI Shep regresses into reaping.

[Alienmorph]

I dunno, doesn't look like Control is a good long-term solution, no matter how we put it.

[magnuskn]

Um, how does my ending mean that? I *don't* think AI Shep regresses into reaping.

You said, and I quote "It was influenced in some meaningful way" in no way automatically means that organic Shepard is the one in charge forever." That means that the Shepard personality is eventually subsumed into the mass conciousness of the Reapers (at which point presumably the original programming of Reaping resumes). Or his personality changes over time, as it does with most beings.

Control, IMO, is only a stop-gap solution. Synthesis is body horror beyond imagination. Destroy is the only way, if only given those three (four, with Refuse) possibilities.

And we already discussed in months past how BioWare wrote themselves in a corner where a martial victory was completely impossible, no matter how much better it would have been for the story to end that way.

[Raga]

Um, how does my ending mean that? I *don't* think AI Shep regresses into reaping.

You said, and I quote "It was influenced in some meaningful way" in no way automatically means that organic Shepard is the one in charge forever." That means that the Shepard personality is eventually subsumed into the mass conciousness of the Reapers (at which point presumably the original programming of Reaping resumes). Or his personality changes over time, as it does with most beings.

It doesn't mean either of those by default. That is an extrapolation. That is what I said. What I *think* happens is that a melding of some kind occurs (in the same vein as Synthesis) at the exact instant Shepard chooses Control and that the entity that is created by that melding will remain the same basically indefinitely or at least until something as equally momentous as Shepard appearing before the Catalyst introduces some truly new data into its programming. By not immediately commencing reaping, I think Shepard AI will not commence reaping indefinitely or again until some unlikely, unforeseen momentous thing umpteen million years in the future.

Again, it comes back to what I said at first. Either you think the Catalyst is speaking horseshit or what it says is essentially true. Which of those you believe changes which is the best solution.

[magnuskn]

I'm firmly on the side of "he's talking horseshit". It's pretty obvious that the Catalyst is not so very subtly trying to steer us away from Destroy (which is why it was presented as the first option and Synthesis as the last).

And, I'm sorry, but what I see in your argument seems to be to be wishful thinking. Locking a personality into statis for millions of years seems far-fetched to me.

[Someone With Mass]

In the case of Renegade Control Shep, I think any change would only be bad, considering that he says "I will lead an army that no one will dare oppose. I will protect, defend. I will destroy those who threaten the future of the many" during his awakening. There's definitely a sinister undertone during that entire speech. Also, based on his dialogue, I'd say that Shepard's experiences are more of guidelines than anything absolute. They taught the entity some values, but there's nothing that says he will follow them no matter what.

Then again, I wouldn't give any organic being with that mentality that kind of power to begin with. It can easily be twisted when that "threat" is a very vague description. Or when it's not specified about what constitutes as "the many", for that matter.

He could decide that committing genocide because a faction of one race attacks another race and thus ensuring that they will never be a problem again is a reasonable answer. It's the stereotypical AI logic patterns in sci-fi, but the risk is there.

[Raga]

And, I'm sorry, but what I see in your argument seems to be to be wishful thinking. Locking a personality into statis for millions of years seems far-fetched to me.

This is precisely what the Catalyst is though. A static personality or consciousness or whatever you want to call it for umpteen millennia. True, it was a really sucky one, but it existed. It confirms that such an unchanging entity can exist.

@SWM

It seems mostly like a flavor difference. If the abiding goal of the Shepard AI is "stop organics from making murderbots" it can do it along a spectrum of severity ranging from "kill the offenders" to the more paragon "zap their tech." Either way, you're fine if you don't make murderbots.

[Alienmorph]

This is precisely what the Catalyst is though. A static personality or consciousness or whatever you want to call it for umpteen millennia. True, it was a really sucky one, but it existed. It confirms that such an unchanging entity can exist.

Not sure if that's a better or worse idea tho. Talk about losing perspective, if you core control consciousness only wakes up for a few years every 50k something.

[Someone With Mass]

It seems mostly like a flavor difference. If the abiding goal of the Shepard AI is "stop organics from making murderbots" it can do it along a spectrum of severity ranging from "kill the offenders" to the more paragon "zap their tech." Either way, you're fine if you don't make murderbots.

See, that's the problem. There's no definite goal for the Shepard AI beyond "protecting the many". It's very vague because it could include protecting them from themselves and then something like the realization that restricting some freedoms like the ability to leisurely use the mass relay network because it's easier to control the few that are suitable for it for example is a step towards a system that's prosperous might pop up.

When people are told that they can't do something they take for granted, they tend to not take it lightly or they split into different groups.

[Raga]

I don't think Shep AI has to go dormant for 50K year intervals. My point is that it doesn't have to be inherently fickle just because Shepard's a part of it.

For the record, I pick Destroy most of the time and my resolve on that ending has solidified as time has gone by. But I can see the logic in Control.

Also, the writing *is* a mess, and as I initially said takes a willingness to swallow large quantities of space magic in order to come to a conclusion other than "this thing is nuts." However, I don't think Bioware intended for the AI to be nuts so I am willing to engage in some good faith rationalization. I don't like the ending, but it's the ending we got. You go to war with the army you have.

[TTTX]

This is precisely what the Catalyst is though. A static personality or consciousness or whatever you want to call it for umpteen millennia. True, it was a really sucky one, but it existed. It confirms that such an unchanging entity can exist.

That depends whether or not the catalyst was on all those years or it simply was like AI "sleeping" through some of it and let the Reapers just follow their programs and do what they wanted.

Because it does seem odd that Shepard is the one being who's "data" seems to be the one that can change the direction of the Reapers even with the Crucible it seems unlikely that Shepard have been the only 1 who have ever been so special and this cycle to be special considering how long the reaping have going on.

But then again that just highlights the error of the writers to give that reason for the Reapers was maybe not the best idea (especially considering how long they have been around it seems to be unnecessary to know whatever the Reapers reason and so late just makes it a pointless Shaymalan twist) and make them exist because "AI and organics will always fight and there has never been a cycle like Shepard's over the course of a billion years" seems very unlikely, especially considering the Catalyst more or less already about know these solutions, but the Crucible somehow makes them new data and solutions (Even though the catalyst have tried synthesis in the past and failed).

[Raga]

Well, using the in-universe logic, the Crucible was not anticipated and it was iterative. On that level, Shepard and Shepard's cycle weren't so much special as lucky. Just like we happen to live in the 100 year span that produced transistors, manned flight, and antibiotics. It's not because we are just special and brilliant and our ancestors were all stupid. It's because we are the lucky beneficiaries of 5000 odd years of cumulative knowledge and circumstance that happened to bear fruit now.

The very fact that the Catalyst knew the Crucible was being built again and again and changed each cycle and its effective response was "eh" speaks to how unchanging its viewpoint is. It took Shepard storming the gates so to speak for it to go "oh wait, there *is* something to this."

[magnuskn]

On the whole, I think the "Dark Energy will screw the galaxy" ending from the leaked script was the better one, IMO.

[Alienmorph]

Even that one was kinda weak really. It's just as if they wanted at all costs to put a final twist at the end of the game to make things less black and white. Could have done that with Cerberus if they really really wanted, instead of making them Cobra 2.0., like having given the collectors' base to TIM actually is what ends up saving the day, or if you spared his life at the final confrontation he's gonna sacrifice himself instead of Shepard. The idea of making a story where the 2km-wide genocidal robots older than life on Earth the good guys or even only some kind of necessary evil doesn't really resonate with me, to say the least. Once you enstablish something so eldritch and horrifying as the Reapers should have been, there's almost no good way to pull a 180 and make them anything but monstrosities to destroy.

[Raga]

There are two main problems with the ending. One is just that Shepard dies and there is basically a big "fuck you" pertaining to the squad which is the main thing like 95% of people care about.

The other problem is that all three choices are given to you via the filter of the Catalyst. Three choices which might otherwise be quite thematically and morally distinct are rendered almost interchangeable by all being couched as "I am the god baby and I am deigning to allow you make one of these three choices. Bow before the certainty of the impending techno apocalypse."

Those exact same three choices would be much less irksome if presented like:

Destroy: Shepard and species of the galaxy just succeed despite the odds and manage to destroy the Reapers.
Control: TIM actually succeeds in his plan and finds a way to control the Reapers. (Serves the double purpose of not rendering Cerberus and the pro-human path utterly inert by the end of ME3).
Synthesis: Starbrat or some other inorganic entity offers you a choice you didn't really expect.

It also neatly sums up the three major narrative strains that have been running through the whole series. Synthesis - Saren. Control - TIM. Destroy - Anderson/Shepard.

[Someone With Mass]

The biggest problem with having the collected species of the galaxy defeat the Reapers on their own is that it undermines the entire point of the Crucible and that it was always suggested that the Reapers couldn't be beaten with brute force.

And really, for a machine race that's older than most stars to fall flat against a collective of species they have already influenced with their technology, it's a bit...well, it kinda declaws the Reapers even more.

I also never really liked how the Reapers lost that personal touch they had in the previous games and now they're just monsters seeking to devour and destroy everything as if they were the Tyranids or something.

Having TIM control the Reapers would also make that ending be even less popular. I honestly wouldn't even consider it. Anything that abides to Mac Walters's hard-on for Cerberus can fuck off.

[UNiT]

I find it hilarious when people claim the reapers was a shit protagonist that ruined the series pretty much then get a much more manageable threat in Andromeda and proceeds to complain again how the villain is shit. People don't know what they want.

[TheodoricFriede]

People don't know what they want.

One of the things I have enjoyed in the most recent Bioware games is that the villains were actually losers pretending to be gods, and ultimately being broken down.

My only real problem with the Archon was that you didn't really get a satisfying moment of destroying him.

[TTTX]

The biggest problem with having the collected species of the galaxy defeat the Reapers on their own is that it undermines the entire point of the Crucible and that it was always suggested that the Reapers couldn't be beaten with brute force.

And really, for a machine race that's older than most stars to fall flat against a collective of species they have already influenced with their technology, it's a bit...well, it kinda declaws the Reapers even more.

I also never really liked how the Reapers lost that personal touch they had in the previous games and now they're just monsters seeking to devour and destroy everything as if they were the Tyranids or something.

Having TIM control the Reapers would also make that ending be even less popular. I honestly wouldn't even consider it. Anything that abides to Mac Walters's hard-on for Cerberus can fuck off.

well having some sort of a superweapon was a giving (which is pretty much ME2 should have been about finding said superweapon instead of doing it all at the start of ME3 in the most stupids way to find it in the Mars archives which humans have been researching for decades and wasting time killing the Collectors.)

I find it hilarious when people claim the reapers was a shit protagonist that ruined the series pretty much then get a much more manageable threat in Andromeda and proceeds to complain again how the villain is shit. People don't know what they want.

The Reapers aren't shit, it just what the writers did with them that's the problem similar to Cerberus.

As for the Kett well they are just copy paste of pretty everything we have ever seen and know of the Reapers, the religious, the superiority complex, turning people into them, etc. if it weren't for the fact we are in another galaxy in ME:A and not in the Milky Way it would have been very easy to theories that they were a species in the Milky Way that worshiped the Reapers, thought they had died and decided to do pretty much what there Gods did, you know if ME:A had taken place in the Milky Way after the Reaper War.

Considering what we know of the Kett right now, calling them the new enemy of the series, is like saying "here is the new boss, he is pretty much the same as the old one".

That's pretty much what makes them shit.

[Alienmorph]

I liked the idea of the reapers, I really really did. My problem is with BW getting shittier with its execution as the story went on.

As for the Archon, I can't even really say that I dislike him. He's so painfully average that wasn't for the fact he's in a Mass Effect game, I'd probably have forgotten about him already.

[Raga]

I have never found a Bioware bad guy particularly compelling except Jon Irenicus from BG2. All the others were just "eh." Loghain at least succeeded in making me hate his guts. The rest haven't even moved me to lukewarm resentment, but as bad guys have next to nothing to do with why I play Bioware games, this isn't a problem.

[Someone With Mass]

As for the Archon, I can't even really say that I dislike him. He's so painfully average that wasn't for the fact he's in a Mass Effect game, I'd probably have forgotten about him already.

At least Saren, Sovereign and Harbinger had memorable speeches. I can't for the life of me remember a single line of the Archon's dialogues.

And I'm the kind of guy that can recite a lot of fictional characters' dialogues in several games.

[UNiT]

I find it hilarious when people claim the reapers was a shit protagonist that ruined the series pretty much then get a much more manageable threat in Andromeda and proceeds to complain again how the villain is shit. People don't know what they want.

The Reapers aren't shit, it just what the writers did with them that's the problem similar to Cerberus.

As for the Kett well they are just copy paste of pretty everything we have ever seen and know of the Reapers, the religious, the superiority complex, turning people into them, etc. if it weren't for the fact we are in another galaxy in ME:A and not in the Milky Way it would have been very easy to theories that they were a species in the Milky Way that worshiped the Reapers, thought they had died and decided to do pretty much what there Gods did, you know if ME:A had taken place in the Milky Way after the Reaper War.

Considering what we know of the Kett right now, calling them the new enemy of the series, is like saying "here is the new boss, he is pretty much the same as the old one".

That's pretty much what makes them shit.

Let's not forget that we have seen only 1 games worth of kett as an enemy so you can't really compare to them much to villains in OT unless you pick Mass Effect 1 only. And then you can see that in Mass Effect you had the geth who weren't really interesting and just random robots enemies you had to kill until ME2 which changed that.
I do agree that the Archon wasn't really the best villain but I do like to bring assholes like him down a notch that think their superior to you in some godly way.

[magnuskn]

The Reapers were fucking terrifying when we did not have a clue why they were going to kill us all. Sovereigns speech to Shepard still rates as one of the top effective villain speeches of all time and still gives me goosebumps to this day. "You exist because we allow it, and you will end because we demand it" is a fucking chilling statement, especially in the context of the other stuff he tells you.

It's only because BioWare thought they needed to excuse the Reapers existance that they got downgraded as terrifying villains, because suddenly their story became stupid and full of plot holes.

Nonetheless, I would have preferred a method to win over them which did not need a giant McGuffin to work.

[Alienmorph]

Let's not forget that we have seen only 1 games worth of kett as an enemy so you can't really compare to them much to villains in OT unless you pick Mass Effect 1 only. And then you can see that in Mass Effect you had the geth who weren't really interesting and just random robots enemies you had to kill until ME2 which changed that.
I do agree that the Archon wasn't really the best villain but I do like to bring assholes like him down a notch that think their superior to you in some godly way.

The Geth had at least a interesting design, and the Reapers were at their best in the first game as a threat. So what's the Kett's excuse?

[UNiT]

Let's not forget that we have seen only 1 games worth of kett as an enemy so you can't really compare to them much to villains in OT unless you pick Mass Effect 1 only. And then you can see that in Mass Effect you had the geth who weren't really interesting and just random robots enemies you had to kill until ME2 which changed that.
I do agree that the Archon wasn't really the best villain but I do like to bring assholes like him down a notch that think their superior to you in some godly way.

The Geth had at least a interesting design, and the Reapers were at their best in the first game as a threat. So what's the Kett's excuse?

Interesting design how exactly? They were just another robot race to shoot at. You mean Sovereign was at his best. Reapers were still outside the galaxy hibernating till the end of ME2.

[TTTX]

I have never found a Bioware bad guy particularly compelling except Jon Irenicus from BG2. All the others were just "eh." Loghain at least succeeded in making me hate his guts. The rest haven't even moved me to lukewarm resentment, but as bad guys have next to nothing to do with why I play Bioware games, this isn't a problem.

it is in ME though, because they add to the growing plotholes in the original trilogy, the Collectors plan is just what was the point (build a Reaper and then what do the same thing Sovereign did)?, Cerberus their leader has been under Reaper control for decades, but doesn't work with the collectors and actively works against the Reapers in ME2 and Reapers plans goes from makes sense to why?

So they might not a be a problem in every BW game, but they are in the original ME trilogy, because they make the writing problems stand out more and you may not care for various reasons, but saying they aren't at least part of the problem it's a not completely true.

Let's not forget that we have seen only 1 games worth of kett as an enemy so you can't really compare to them much to villains in OT unless you pick Mass Effect 1 only. And then you can see that in Mass Effect you had the geth who weren't really interesting and just random robots enemies you had to kill until ME2 which changed that.
I do agree that the Archon wasn't really the best villain but I do like to bring assholes like him down a notch that think their superior to you in some godly way.

yeah, but here is the thing with the geth (as the example you used) in ME1 their story and background tied in with the Quarians and we had to Tali to fill us in on their story so you could at come up with theories on why they joined up with Sovereign and started killing people.

With the Kett it's really more just guessing out of the blue (and that's our lore of Andromeda is pretty thin compared to the Milky Way, so we don't have many sources to take from and since the jardaan meddled so much with the cluster, there is even a hint they also created the animal life in cluster so it makes it even harder to come up with a theory why the Kett is well being them especially when they aren't from the cluster and the cluster is so meddle with because of the Jardaan), because we barely know anything other then they have an empire, just like being dicks to everyone and make them into into new Kett. We have already face an enemy very similar to the Kett in the original trilogy (the Kett even have a version of indoctrination) and BW doesn't do anything really new with the Kett, it comes across as "haven't we done this already?" and that doesn't help when ME:A is suppose to be a fresh start.

at least with the Jardaan and their Remnant tech while there are similirates with the Protheans (in some areas), they at least comes across as different with the whole creating life and make planets livable, their tech and such

[Alienmorph]

I dunno, I always liked the geth's design. And in the first game you even had some extra variations like the creepy crawler ones I really wish they didn't get rid of.

And yes, that's what I meant. Sovereign was a very menacin villain, and all we see and learn through it and Saren about the Reapers as an whole was very menacing and cool.

[magnuskn]

And yes, that's what I meant. Sovereign was a very menacin villain, and all we see and learn through it and Saren about the Reapers as an whole was very menacing and cool.

Sovereign was the representative of the Reapers. We did get a very good indication of the threat they pose, both on an individual level (Sovereign) and the Reapers as a whole (Sovereigns speech about the endless cycles and their numbers darkening the sky). The Reapers are a real enemy in ME 1 and trying to dismiss that misses the point of the whole trilogy, which is stopping the Reapers.

Saren and the Geth are just minions of Sovereign and by association the Reapers in ME 1.

[Someone With Mass]

I dunno, I always liked the geth's design. And in the first game you even had some extra variations like the creepy crawler ones I really wish they didn't get rid of.

Well, it was less getting rid of and more "Oh god, our game can't handle these spaz-tastic geth jumping everywhere!", but I agree. Even if they were the bane of my existence, they brought something I haven't seen since in Mass Effect.

[Raga]

With those things pause and play is your friend. I actually used the fuck out of that feature and wish it was still in Andromeda.

[UNiT]

I'll be blunt. ME2 ruined the over all plot for Mass Effect. And the sad thing is, you only need to change a few things here and there to make it all work.

[Someone With Mass]

With those things pause and play is your friend. I actually used the fuck out of that feature and wish it was still in Andromeda.

Yup. I never saw what was so bad about it, nor did I understand the need to get rid of it. Oh no, you waste literally seconds by pausing the game and being able to take in the situation...surely you can feel yourself waste away...

Not to mention that it could have brought back some proper squad commands instead of having to trust the dumb AI to realize that I'm setting people up for combos and NOT fire off powers whenever possible.

[UNiT]

My guess is that more information about the kett was saved for DLC or sequel. But right now as is we may never know much about the kett.

[Someone With Mass]

I'll be blunt. ME2 ruined the over all plot for Mass Effect. And the sad thing is, you only need to change a few things here and there to make it all work.

To also be blunt, I liked the interactions with the characters more than the main story in all of the Mass Effect games. That said, it could have been The Magnificent Seven instead of The Dirty Dozen.

That was ME2's biggest problem. It didn't know when to stop.

[TTTX]

I'll be blunt. ME2 ruined the over all plot for Mass Effect. And the sad thing is, you only need to change a few things here and there to make it all work.

pretty much, but it's not surprising considering the writers had a make it up as they went along attitude towards writing the ME trilogy (which isn't bad per say, but when you don't follow the simple guideline about writing a trilogy with an overarching story which basically first arc sets up the scenario, second arc continues the plot and bring it forward and the third one deals and ends the scenario tying up as many lose ends as possible, not much different then writing a single book, a start, a middle and an end).

To also be blunt, I liked the interactions with the characters than the main story in all of the Mass Effect games. That said, it could have been The Magnificent Seven instead of The Dirty Dozen.

That was ME2's biggest problem. It didn't know when to stop.

I think the biggest problem with ME2 it didn't know where to begin or what to do (in many ways the plot is very much like a Michael Bay Transformers movies, reference the first game a little, but other then that ignore it, humans takes center stage, have some sort of antagonist so we have an excuse for a much action as possible and have them work for the Reapers so we can still pretend to be a sequel and have every woman on the squad where nothing but skimpy outfits, because male perverts are the only ones who play this game *sarcasm*, have the hero say something cool and reveal something for the sequel).

[UNiT]

Patch 1.09 changelog

[Raga]

I'll be blunt. ME2 ruined the over all plot for Mass Effect. And the sad thing is, you only need to change a few things here and there to make it all work.

To also be blunt, I liked the interactions with the characters than the main story in all of the Mass Effect games. That said, it could have been The Magnificent Seven instead of The Dirty Dozen.

That was ME2's biggest problem. It didn't know when to stop.

This. I don't give a crap about the plot of Bioware games. I am here for the character vignettes.

[Mazder]

Patch 1.09 changelog

Apparently the Batarian MP character is one of TWO Batarians in Andromeda because the Systems Alliance Witness protection failed after they ratted out their pirate gang boss, so they went to the Initiative to provide security for the Salarians.
So, two Batarians apparently.
In all of Andromeda.

[Someone With Mass]

Patch 1.09 changelog

Holy shit, they added like 15 new equipment, bulwark, concussion and siphon versions of every weapon, veteran bonuses to characters (who can now GO BEYOND the tenth rank) and pretty much all the weapon mods that were in the singleplayer.

Oh and the Kishock harpoon gun is back. Eh. That thing was awful if you weren't the host in ME3 and I doubt it'll be much better here.

You can also now use the mission funds to straight up buy ultra-rare characters.

Edit: Aaaaand the very first plat lobby I joined is a hacked one, so infinite health and ammo for everyone...yay. Nothing like being able to one-shot the new boss with a power. Also, you get around 120k credits for a full platinum extraction.

[TTTX]

This. I don't give a crap about the plot of Bioware games. I am here for the character vignettes.

Perhaps you don't, but it's because of ME2 plot being about nothing other fuck around until the Reapers show up (and the main goal of the trilogy is stopping the Reapers), did put ME3 in a jam because it basically had to do everything ME2 didn't do, secure alliances, find the super weapon, while trying to set up the end of the series and ending the series at the same time, it basically set up ME3 to fail from the start and pretty much helped put the entire franchis on ice (it's obviously not the entire reason, but it is one of the reasons).

It doesn't make ME2 a crappy game far from it, but from a story point of view it's a very crappy sequel.

[Someone With Mass]

Apparently the Batarian MP character is one of TWO Batarians in Andromeda because the Systems Alliance Witness protection failed after they ratted out their pirate gang boss, so they went to the Initiative to provide security for the Salarians.
So, two Batarians apparently.
In all of Andromeda.

Still not as stupid as not outfitting their ships with weapons, if you ask me.

[Mazder]

Apparently the Batarian MP character is one of TWO Batarians in Andromeda because the Systems Alliance Witness protection failed after they ratted out their pirate gang boss, so they went to the Initiative to provide security for the Salarians.
So, two Batarians apparently.
In all of Andromeda.

Still not as stupid as not outfitting their ships with weapons, if you ask me.

yeah.

Also the purchasing characters with points is only for 6 days.
Mind you I am still slumming it in bronze level stuff so....I'm never seeing the new stuff.

[UNiT]

Jessus fucknig christ. Platinum in Andromeda is even harder than in ME3MP WTF. I'm gonna need to find a a proper team to farm this shit. Bosses everywhere good luck trying to cap an objective with 2 purple destroyers standing on it.

Everyone who is skilled at MP your welcome to add me on Origin UNiT-N7.